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 ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate? 
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Post ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
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How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
May, 10, 2010
by Tim Graham

Brandon Marshall, Randy Moss, Wes Welker, Santonio Holmes, Braylon Edwards, Lee Evans.

That's quite a collection of receiving talent in the AFC East, providing a sense the division contains some of the elite receiving corps in the league.

Not so fast.

Jason Cole of Yahoo! Sports composed a reasonable set of rankings for each collection of targets and doesn't have any AFC East team listed in the top third and three of the four ranked no better than the midline.

11. New England Patriots

* Cole's take: If Wes Welker was healthy, this group would rank higher. Adding Torry Holt helps, although we'll see how he gets along with Randy Moss.
* My take: The Patriots have some question marks. Age is a concern with Moss and Holt, and they don't have an established tight end. They'll probably need sophomore Julian Edelman to stand in for Welker for a few weeks. That said, Cole's ranking is fair.

16. New York Jets

* Cole's take: If Braylon Edwards returns to Pro Bowl form and Santonio Holmes can get his head straight, this group could be awesome by December. If so, the Jets will be a serious contender.
* My take: The caveats are warranted, but I think Cole rated the Jets too poorly. Once Holmes finishes his four-game suspension, they will field three 1,000-yard receivers and one of the NFL's top young receiving tight ends in Dustin Keller.

19. Miami Dolphins

* Cole's take: The Dolphins finally landed a No. 1 receiver in Brandon Marshall after years of not having one. The question is whether Marshall will be enough.
* My take: Dolfans have taken exception to Cole's rating. I wonder if they're the same ones upset I ranked Mark Sanchez slightly ahead of Chad Henne; the main point of contention is the Dolphins had substandard receivers last year. I'd have the Dolphins a couple of rungs higher than 19th, but Cole's assessment is fair. Their top three wideouts last year were undrafted, undrafted and since released. One star doesn't a receiving corps make.

25. Buffalo Bills

* Cole's take: Much like good friend and former Wisconsin teammate Chris Chambers, Lee Evans spent a career teasing people with his talent. Sorry, but it's hard to believe he'll ever be truly great.
* My take: After six seasons, Evans' career is shaping up as disappointing. The Bills need third-year receivers James Hardy and Steve Johnson and second-year tight end Shawn Nelson to make an impact this year. Rookie Marcus Easley is intriguing.


http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/ ... corps-rate

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
19????...ahh I guess that is close to the truth. But with Marshall here it should go up.....any1 know what # he is going to pick?????

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
This is freakin' hillarious. I don't understand how they can come up with these things. How can you compare the receiving corps? They don't play against each other and secondly they don't have the same coordinator nor same type of QB. This is really ridiculous I wish these reporters would stop just because there's nothing to report.


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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
finfan808 wrote:
This is freakin' hillarious. I don't understand how they can come up with these things. How can you compare the receiving corps? They don't play against each other and secondly they don't have the same coordinator nor same type of QB. This is really ridiculous I wish these reporters would stop just because there's nothing to report.



So you can't compare QB's either by your logic? : )


It's just an article to give a glimpse of the quality of recieving lineups from the writers' perspective, 'is all

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
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Their top three wideouts last year were undrafted, undrafted and since released.


Hartline was drafted...


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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Hartline wasnt top 3, he was # 4 in stats.... Although he had as many yards with less catches... Our 3 WR last year were Camarillo - Bess - Ginn.....


No sense paying these any attention, all just for bragging rights for now... Pitt was ranked up high across the board last off season, they didn't make the playoffs....

The fact is we have the best WR in this division, even if everyone still wants to gve Moss the credit, I think Marshall is better.

Give the other 3 guys a year without being doubled and we will see how they do....

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Miami recievers in first pre-season game, other than Brandon Marshall: "wth?? I'm open??!"

: )

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
10acjed wrote:
Hartline wasnt top 3, he was # 4 in stats.... Although he had as many yards with less catches... Our 3 WR last year were Camarillo - Bess - Ginn.....


No sense paying these any attention, all just for bragging rights for now... Pitt was ranked up high across the board last off season, they didn't make the playoffs....

The fact is we have the best WR in this division, even if everyone still wants to gve Moss the credit, I think Marshall is better.

Give the other 3 guys a year without being doubled and we will see how they do....


:yay: my thoughts exactly.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
enJeppesen wrote:
Miami recievers in first pre-season game, other than Brandon Marshall: "wth?? I'm open??!"

: )


It will be a pick your poison offense to defend... Let the WR's go out with single coverege, or hope the R&R express dont get past the first wall...

We should actually have a decent offense... Lets just hope our D is much improved...

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
I would hope Miami uses more 3 receiver sets with 2 backs. The TE position is the weakest on the offensive side, so utilize your talents. Bess in the slot will be extremely dangerous. I see no reason why Miami can't roll up 30 points a game.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Iowafin wrote:
I would hope Miami uses more 3 receiver sets with 2 backs. The TE position is the weakest on the offensive side, so utilize your talents. Bess in the slot will be extremely dangerous. I see no reason why Miami can't roll up 30 points a game.

And the D-fence holds teams to 21 or less.......I can see that 11-5 this year.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
He places way too much emphasis on draft position. Bess has been brilliant since he started. He's sneaky, quick, knows how to get open, and can catch almost anything. He now has a track record of making clutch plays. I'd rather have him playing in the slot than many other receivers in the league. We have catches everything with Camarillo and a guy who's coming along nuclei in Hartline. We have a complete unit. Marshall may be the only star, but I think receiver, assuming that Marshall stays healthy, is one of the best units on the team. It went from a liability to a strength.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
I do like Bess....but I think the love affair with him is a little overdone. The guy has no ability to make big plays and gets nothing after the catch. He works hard and can get those short yards you need from the slot, but that is about it.

However, our receiving corps will be much better than that stupid analyst predicts (19th...what joke). Marshall will likely give us 1,000 yards and 10 TD's in his typical year of work. Hartline will be more experience, start from day 1 at the #2 WR position and benefit from coverage rotating to Marshall. He should be very productive in that role. Our offense should vault right into the top 10.....I would be surprised if that isn't the case.

Now....our defense.....that is the huge question mark......lots of youth there.....new scheme.....our safety position was horrible last year and we only have hope that it will be better this year.

I am hopeful that the defense will be improved, but although I am excited about the front 7...I am much more leery that our secondary is still too young and unsettled.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
I do like Bess....but I think the love affair with him is a little overdone. The guy has no ability to make big plays and gets nothing after the catch. He works hard and can get those short yards you need from the slot, but that is about it.

However, our receiving corps will be much better than that stupid analyst predicts (19th...what joke). Marshall will likely give us 1,000 yards and 10 TD's in his typical year of work. Hartline will be more experience, start from day 1 at the #2 WR position and benefit from coverage rotating to Marshall. He should be very productive in that role. Our offense should vault right into the top 10.....I would be surprised if that isn't the case.

Now....our defense.....that is the huge question mark......lots of youth there.....new scheme.....our safety position was horrible last year and we only have hope that it will be better this year.

I am hopeful that the defense will be improved, but although I am excited about the front 7...I am much more leery that our secondary is still too young and unsettled.


Bess became a focus for opposing defenses last year because he was consistently getting open and making plays. He had a few bad games, but other than that the guy has been money. Now that we have Marshall, a lot will open up for our other receivers. This will be Bess' third year and supposedly it takes 3 years for a WR to get up to NFL speed, so I would expect Bess to have a great year and might possibly be in the pro bowl mix.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
I do like Bess....but I think the love affair with him is a little overdone. The guy has no ability to make big plays and gets nothing after the catch.


Again, do I need to refer to the post where I show that he is tops in the league with YAC? I can also show you this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrtGdAgW ... re=related

I don't who you've been watching, but Bess makes plays every stinkin' game. No abilities to make big plays...what a joke.

You were probably the same guy that was glad Miami traded Welker and thought they got good value for him because "He only scored one touchdown."

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Davone Bess is tops in the league (not sure which league you are talking about) in YAC?????.....NOT.....he leads Miami's pathetic 2009 corps and that is all....

Here is the AFC stats for YAC as of 1/3/2010....that is AFC mind you, and not the NFL. Bess is tied for 17th....yawn:

AFC Leaders: Yards After Catch (Receivers) (Thru Jan. 3, 2010)

Rank Player Team Stats
1 Ray Rice Bal 757
2 Wes Welker NE 721
3 Darren Sproles SD 562
4 Chris Johnson Ten 542
5 Andre Johnson Hou 538
6 Brandon Marshall Den 527
7 Antonio Gates SD 520
8 Santonio Holmes Pit 516
9 Steve Slaton Hou 463
10 Dallas Clark Ind 460
11 Fred Jackson Buf 430
12 Reggie Wayne Ind 428
13 Heath Miller Pit 400
14 Hines Ward Pit 394
15 Maurice Jones-Drew Jac 379
16 Zach Miller Oak 366
17t Joseph Addai Ind 324
17t Davone Bess Mia 324
19 Randy Moss NE 319
20 Pierre Garcon Ind 295

http://stats.nj.com/fb/leaders.asp?rang ... =231&year=

In two years Bess has amassed:

130 catches 1312 yards 10.1 yard average 3 TD's

Yes, he is a good player. He is not spectacular and he is not a game breaker at all. He will help move the chains.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
Davone Bess is tops in the league (not sure which league you are talking about) in YAC?????.....NOT.....he leads Miami's pathetic 2009 corps and that is all....

Here is the AFC stats for YAC as of 1/3/2010....that is AFC mind you, and not the NFL. Bess is tied for 17th....yawn:

AFC Leaders: Yards After Catch (Receivers) (Thru Jan. 3, 2010)

Rank Player Team Stats
1 Ray Rice Bal 757
2 Wes Welker NE 721
3 Darren Sproles SD 562
4 Chris Johnson Ten 542
5 Andre Johnson Hou 538
6 Brandon Marshall Den 527
7 Antonio Gates SD 520
8 Santonio Holmes Pit 516
9 Steve Slaton Hou 463
10 Dallas Clark Ind 460
11 Fred Jackson Buf 430
12 Reggie Wayne Ind 428
13 Heath Miller Pit 400
14 Hines Ward Pit 394
15 Maurice Jones-Drew Jac 379
16 Zach Miller Oak 366
17t Joseph Addai Ind 324
17t Davone Bess Mia 324
19 Randy Moss NE 319
20 Pierre Garcon Ind 295

All right...I'll just go ahead and break it down for you.

First, you can go ahead and throw out the running backs. They aren't receivers, and get a lot of YAC on screen plays. Then, look at the average per catch...
1. Pierre Garcon 6.0
2. Wes Welker 5.8
3. Santonio Holmes 5.7
4. Andre Johnson 5.0
4. Brandon Marshall 5.0
6. Heath Miller 5.4
7. Dallas Clark 5.1
8. Antonio Gates 4.8
9. Zach Miller 4.7
10. Davone Bess 4.6
11. Hines Ward 4.4
12. Randy Moss 4.0
13. Reggie Wayne 3.8

He's in the top 10 here out of that list you gave....but now let's compare him to the top receivers in the league. This is their career YAC average.
Steve Smith 6.2
Randy Moss 4.0
Reggie Wayne 3.8
Andre Johnson 5.0
Larry Fitzgerald 3.5
Marvin Harrison 3.3
Terrell Owens 5.4

We'd all agree those are "big play" receivers, right? Davone Bess would be right behind Smith, Owens and Johnson at 4.6

Regardless, you said he gets "nothing after the catch," and "has no ability to make the big play." That is 100% false.

Watch that video I gave you. That is Bess going 40 some yards against the Ravens. He's the only guy that scored against that defense in the regular season. He scored that long one against the Steelers. You can get it to him on 3rd down and watch him get the extra 2 yards needed....throw it to him on a bubble screen, a jailbreak screen, hit him on a dig route, a comeback, a post....he can run any route you ask him and he's shown he can make the tough catch.

You are dead wrong about Bess.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
Davone Bess is tops in the league (not sure which league you are talking about) in YAC?????.....NOT.....he leads Miami's pathetic 2009 corps and that is all....

Here is the AFC stats for YAC as of 1/3/2010....that is AFC mind you, and not the NFL. Bess is tied for 17th....yawn:

AFC Leaders: Yards After Catch (Receivers) (Thru Jan. 3, 2010)

Rank Player Team Stats
1 Ray Rice Bal 757
2 Wes Welker NE 721
3 Darren Sproles SD 562
4 Chris Johnson Ten 542
5 Andre Johnson Hou 538
6 Brandon Marshall Den 527
7 Antonio Gates SD 520
8 Santonio Holmes Pit 516
9 Steve Slaton Hou 463
10 Dallas Clark Ind 460
11 Fred Jackson Buf 430
12 Reggie Wayne Ind 428
13 Heath Miller Pit 400
14 Hines Ward Pit 394
15 Maurice Jones-Drew Jac 379
16 Zach Miller Oak 366
17t Joseph Addai Ind 324
17t Davone Bess Mia 324
19 Randy Moss NE 319
20 Pierre Garcon Ind 295

http://stats.nj.com/fb/leaders.asp?rang ... =231&year=

In two years Bess has amassed:

130 catches 1312 yards 10.1 yard average 3 TD's

Yes, he is a good player. He is not spectacular and he is not a game breaker at all. He will help move the chains.


Are you serious. 17th for a guy not drafted is spectacular. Furthermore, did you even look at the fact he was above both Moss and Garcon? That list of players is certainly the "A" list and when you consider that RB's are a part of the list (Is there anything but YAC for a RB catching a flare out of the backfield?) then it is even more impressive. Consider Miami has two guys in that top 20. The Jet's have 1 but are ranked 3 spots higher because???


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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Iowafin wrote:
.........Watch that video I gave you. That is Bess going 40 some yards against the Ravens. He's the only guy that scored against that defense in the regular season. He scored that long one against the Steelers. You can get it to him on 3rd down and watch him get the extra 2 yards needed....throw it to him on a bubble screen, a jailbreak screen, hit him on a dig route, a comeback, a post....he can run any route you ask him and he's shown he can make the tough catch.

You are dead wrong about Bess.


Hey Iowa let's not forget the Raiders game when he carried pretty much the whole secondary and extra 6 or 7 yards.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... iders-2008
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... riots-2008
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/09 ... neers-2009

The point in showing these videos is that if you get any receiver the ball in stride, he gets a chance to make a play. Most of Bess' career has been catching hooks and comebacks and Bubble screens. I don't think he had much of a chance to get YAC. I would bet that his YAC is significantly different once there was a QB change.


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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
finfan808 wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
.........Watch that video I gave you. That is Bess going 40 some yards against the Ravens. He's the only guy that scored against that defense in the regular season. He scored that long one against the Steelers. You can get it to him on 3rd down and watch him get the extra 2 yards needed....throw it to him on a bubble screen, a jailbreak screen, hit him on a dig route, a comeback, a post....he can run any route you ask him and he's shown he can make the tough catch.

You are dead wrong about Bess.


Hey Iowa let's not forget the Raiders game when he carried pretty much the whole secondary and extra 6 or 7 yards.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... iders-2008
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... riots-2008
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/09 ... neers-2009

The point in showing these videos is that if you get any receiver the ball in stride, he gets a chance to make a play. Most of Bess' career has been catching hooks and comebacks and Bubble screens. I don't think he had much of a chance to get YAC. I would bet that his YAC is significantly different once there was a QB change.


Those were all BIG time plays in the 4th quarter.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Tied for 17th in the AFC.....17th in yards after the catch. Yes...other great receivers averaged less....but they also have much higher average yards PER catch. Bess is a fine slot receiver....but calling him a big play guy is kind of silly. He is solid. He will help you move the chains...provided it isn't much over 10 yards from the line of scrimmage. He is not a homerun hitter. He was an outstanding free agent signing, but pointing to Steve Smith's lower yards after the catch number and comparing it to Bess won't make me think for a minute that Bess is the better receiver...he isn't. His total yards after the catch was more a factor of the sheer number of catches he made (76) then his ability to make a play with the ball after he caught it. In fact, just checked the stats. Bess averaged 4.3 yards after each catch....a top WR for comparison....the one someone used in this thread already....Steve Smith of the Panthers...he averaged 5.6 yards after each catch. I like Bess, but he is not an elite receiver by any stretch. A warrior, a football player, an important part of the team....yes. An elite or top tier receiver, no.

Our receiving corps was pretty poor last year. Hartline was a nice surprise and will probably have an outstanding 2nd year. Marshall will likely step in and show us just how bad our passing game has been of late....he will make our offense far more productive. I predict Bess sees a reduction in catches next year....we simply won't have to lean on him as much.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
Tied for 17th in the AFC.....17th in yards after the catch. Yes...other great receivers averaged less....but they also have much higher average yards PER catch. Bess is a fine slot receiver....but calling him a big play guy is kind of silly. He is solid. He will help you move the chains...provided it isn't much over 10 yards from the line of scrimmage. He is not a homerun hitter. He was an outstanding free agent signing, but pointing to Steve Smith's lower yards after the catch number and comparing it to Bess won't make me think for a minute that Bess is the better receiver...he isn't. His total yards after the catch was more a factor of the sheer number of catches he made (76) then his ability to make a play with the ball after he caught it. In fact, just checked the stats. Bess averaged 4.3 yards after each catch....a top WR for comparison....the one someone used in this thread already....Steve Smith of the Panthers...he averaged 5.6 yards after each catch. I like Bess, but he is not an elite receiver by any stretch. A warrior, a football player, an important part of the team....yes. An elite or top tier receiver, no.

Our receiving corps was pretty poor last year. Hartline was a nice surprise and will probably have an outstanding 2nd year. Marshall will likely step in and show us just how bad our passing game has been of late....he will make our offense far more productive. I predict Bess sees a reduction in catches next year....we simply won't have to lean on him as much.


Clearly you didn't read anything that was posted above you.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
finfan808 wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
.........Watch that video I gave you. That is Bess going 40 some yards against the Ravens. He's the only guy that scored against that defense in the regular season. He scored that long one against the Steelers. You can get it to him on 3rd down and watch him get the extra 2 yards needed....throw it to him on a bubble screen, a jailbreak screen, hit him on a dig route, a comeback, a post....he can run any route you ask him and he's shown he can make the tough catch.

You are dead wrong about Bess.


Hey Iowa let's not forget the Raiders game when he carried pretty much the whole secondary and extra 6 or 7 yards.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... iders-2008
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... riots-2008
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/09 ... neers-2009

The point in showing these videos is that if you get any receiver the ball in stride, he gets a chance to make a play. Most of Bess' career has been catching hooks and comebacks and Bubble screens. I don't think he had much of a chance to get YAC. I would bet that his YAC is significantly different once there was a QB change.


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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
He's not going to watch that video PR, nor will he look at the stats. His facts are that Davone Bess is average at best.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Iowafin wrote:
He's not going to watch that video PR, nor will he look at the stats. His facts are that Davone Bess is average at best.


I agree Iowa, that video proves nothing, except that Davone Bess makes plays. :grin:


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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
Bess will have a huge year with Marshall taking a lot of the pressure off of him. For a 2nd year undrafted player to be on a list with those names is amazing, and for anyone to call him just average is ridiculous.

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Post Re: ESPN - How do AFC East receiving corps rate?
I'm with Iowa on this one. Bess is good after the catch. His strength is underrated and he is VERY slippery.

I love that long one against the Ravens.. He "breaks" Ed Reed's knees on that juke full speed. Sick nasty. He is going to be great in the slot.

I love our WR corps this year if Marshall can stay out of trouble. Marshall, Hartline/Cam and Bess in the slot. Clutch.

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Mon May 17, 2010 11:49 am
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