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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:09 pm 
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jammer wrote:
MiamiMenace wrote:
Heres the deal. How has the GOP and the Right been doing the last 8 yrs?


Considering they now control both Houses of Congress, the majority of the governorships and are completely dominating in their control of state legislatures...I'd say not too bad.

A statistic just recently came out that the president's margin of victory in a lot of key states was dictated by the African American voter turnout. That isn't happening for Hillary Clinton.

Another important statistic showed that a lot of conservatives or "right" voters failed to show up for Romney because he didn't take a bigger stand on social issues. I think the current crop of GOP candidates are quite aware of this and trying get that crowd's support for the nomination.

To an extent I agree with you. Jobs, immigration and foreign policy will dominate this election.


Jammer just keeps on winning. I'm enjoying this.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:15 pm 
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AQNOR wrote:
I think it is a complete myth that the religious right is the reason the GOP lost the last two elections.


Studies done on the demographics of the voting public show that white Evangelicals did not have the same turnout for McCain and Romney as they did with Bush and the margins could have covered what McCain or Romney needed to win some purple states like Ohio.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:09 pm 
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AQNOR wrote:
There are if I remember correctly about 8 or 9 states that have no restrictions for killing of babies in the womb.

I would disagree that the religious right has been running the last 8 years. What has been running is Rino's (republican in name only) and moderate candidates. If a true conservative ran who could articulate their position well and call out the problems with who they were running against without fear than I think that person could win. I think it is a complete myth that the religious right is the reason the GOP lost the last two elections.

I think the country needs to get back on track too and stop murdering children. Front burner issue. If we don't value the life of the most vulnerable among us then I think we have lost something valuable.


Newsflash. You won't ever stop abortions. Never. Best way to deal with it is give women education and good medical procedures. That will save life all around.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:16 pm 
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Coots wrote:
jammer wrote:
MiamiMenace wrote:
Heres the deal. How has the GOP and the Right been doing the last 8 yrs?


Considering they now control both Houses of Congress, the majority of the governorships and are completely dominating in their control of state legislatures...I'd say not too bad.

A statistic just recently came out that the president's margin of victory in a lot of key states was dictated by the African American voter turnout. That isn't happening for Hillary Clinton.

Another important statistic showed that a lot of conservatives or "right" voters failed to show up for Romney because he didn't take a bigger stand on social issues. I think the current crop of GOP candidates are quite aware of this and trying get that crowd's support for the nomination.

To an extent I agree with you. Jobs, immigration and foreign policy will dominate this election.


Jammer just keeps on winning. I'm enjoying this.


I didn't think this was about winning. I thought it was a discussion? You think the GOP is doing well? Did you see who the latest supreme court appointments voted? Obama care is in full swing. Obama will veto the Iran deal and good luck on getting a majority vote to overturn it.

As well as the majority black vote goes just look at what's happening in Ferguson Miss. All designed to piss off the minority and come out swinging in 2016.

Still think your winning? We are all losing bro........glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:41 pm 
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MiamiMenace wrote:
I didn't think this was about winning. I thought it was a discussion? You think the GOP is doing well? Did you see who the latest supreme court appointments voted? Obama care is in full swing. Obama will veto the Iran deal and good luck on getting a majority vote to overturn it.

As well as the majority black vote goes just look at what's happening in Ferguson Miss. All designed to piss off the minority and come out swinging in 2016.

Still think your winning? We are all losing bro........glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president.


First of all, you don't label or tie me to any party or candidate without knowing my views or understanding my views. Thanks.

If you're to the point of taking "winning" so literal, then maybe you should think about what you're doing here in this discussion. Does it bother you that I sided with what Jammer said vs. what you said? Obviously so. Pretty typical... I see nothing new out of you, ever.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:01 pm 
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Coots wrote:
MiamiMenace wrote:
I didn't think this was about winning. I thought it was a discussion? You think the GOP is doing well? Did you see who the latest supreme court appointments voted? Obama care is in full swing. Obama will veto the Iran deal and good luck on getting a majority vote to overturn it.

As well as the majority black vote goes just look at what's happening in Ferguson Miss. All designed to piss off the minority and come out swinging in 2016.

Still think your winning? We are all losing bro........glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president.


First of all, you don't label or tie me to any party or candidate without knowing my views or understanding my views. Thanks.

If you're to the point of taking "winning" so literal, then maybe you should think about what you're doing here in this discussion. Does it bother you that I sided with what Jammer said vs. what you said? Obviously so. Pretty typical... I see nothing new out of you, ever.



Now your getting defensive. Ok. I don't know what side of anything your on. I just know what you said. And I'm glad you see nothing new. I try to remain consistent. Making this country better for my children. That's all. The ones winning and losing are probably not even born yet.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:04 pm 
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Coots, getting defensive over nothing? Those are the people you don't want to get into a discussion with. Then again, it's usually best to not even get involved in these type of "debates" on the internet since it always ends up going nowhere.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:08 pm 
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Cathal wrote:
Coots, getting defensive over nothing? Those are the people you don't want to get into a discussion with. Then again, it's usually best to not even get involved in these type of "debates" on the internet since it always ends up going nowhere.


Is there a debate on the Internet that ends up going anywhere?

It seems you have unrealistic expectations for your Internet debates. You're setting yourself up for perpetual disappointment.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:26 pm 
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Rich wrote:
AQNOR wrote:
I think it is a complete myth that the religious right is the reason the GOP lost the last two elections.


Studies done on the demographics of the voting public show that white Evangelicals did not have the same turnout for McCain and Romney as they did with Bush and the margins could have covered what McCain or Romney needed to win some purple states like Ohio.


Turnout for Romney: 26%
Turnout for McCain: 26%
Turnout for Bush 04: 23%


Are you referring to a state by state basis? These are the nat'l polls




http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sp ... table.html
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/result ... al=USP00p2
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/ ... lls.0.html

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:43 pm 
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In terms of demographics, the GOP problem is the only demographic they win is whites. They lose African Americans, Latinos, Asians, and Others.

And the white vote's share of the electorate shrinks ever so slightly each election. Remember, the GOP has only won 1 popular vote in the last 6 elections.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:51 pm 
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MiamiMenace wrote:
Did you see who the latest supreme court appointments voted?


You mean how? Mixed Results for me. Didn't like the voting rights ruling, but enjoyed the Obamacare and Gay Marriage one.

MiamiMenace wrote:
Obama care is in full swing.


Good. Unless you want to replace it with single payer or public option, then I am all for getting rid of it.

MiamiMenace wrote:
Obama will veto the Iran deal and good luck on getting a majority vote to overturn it.


Yes, he will veto the opposition to the deal. Good.

MiamiMenace wrote:
glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president.


That works for me.



Sorry, just felt like being the smug liberal here. Carry on.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:06 pm 
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jammer wrote:
A statistic just recently came out that the president's margin of victory in a lot of key states was dictated by the African American voter turnout. That isn't happening for Hillary Clinton.

Another important statistic showed that a lot of conservatives or "right" voters failed to show up for Romney because he didn't take a bigger stand on social issues. I think the current crop of GOP candidates are quite aware of this and trying get that crowd's support for the nomination.



A couple of things:

Do you think the general public agrees with conservatives on social issues? I don't see how going further right helps, unless they can get some massive amount of turnout that dwarfs the votes they lose by being so far right.

To your point, based on the same exit polls from the links in an earlier post:

Self Identified Conservatives Turnout:

2012: 35% of electorate
2008: 34% of electorate
2004: 34% of electorate

As for the African American turnout, that involves a lot of math to see if it would have made a difference. Maybe later. Unless you have a link?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:37 pm 
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1984phins wrote:
A couple of things:

Do you think the general public agrees with conservatives on social issues? I don't see how going further right helps, unless they can get some massive amount of turnout that dwarfs the votes they lose by being so far right.

To your point, based on the same exit polls from the links in an earlier post:

Self Identified Conservatives Turnout:

2012: 35% of electorate
2008: 34% of electorate
2004: 34% of electorate

As for the African American turnout, that involves a lot of math to see if it would have made a difference. Maybe later. Unless you have a link?


I think more people agree with the right than the media lets on, otherwise you wouldn't have such a heavy reliance on the courts to settle issues and more things like marriage and abortion don't end up on ballots.

The whole idea of conservative (or liberal for that matter) is a bit foolish to me. I'm very conservative on the fiscal side but support gay marriage and am somewhere in the middle on the issue of abortion. I know people who are extremely conservative on social issues but are darn near Bernie Sanders in terms of government spending.

If we're really being honest, I absolutely love the cracks that are developing in each party right now because there should be room for more interpretation and less labeling when it comes to your politics. Hillary Clinton/Jeb Bush - serve the same master and yield the same results. They'll just package it differently.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 6:13 pm 
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Need to factor in the Lois Lerner effect.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 6:46 pm 
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MiamiMenace wrote:
Coots wrote:
MiamiMenace wrote:
I didn't think this was about winning. I thought it was a discussion? You think the GOP is doing well? Did you see who the latest supreme court appointments voted? Obama care is in full swing. Obama will veto the Iran deal and good luck on getting a majority vote to overturn it.

As well as the majority black vote goes just look at what's happening in Ferguson Miss. All designed to piss off the minority and come out swinging in 2016.

Still think your winning? We are all losing bro........glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president.


First of all, you don't label or tie me to any party or candidate without knowing my views or understanding my views. Thanks.

If you're to the point of taking "winning" so literal, then maybe you should think about what you're doing here in this discussion. Does it bother you that I sided with what Jammer said vs. what you said? Obviously so. Pretty typical... I see nothing new out of you, ever.



Now your getting defensive. Ok. I don't know what side of anything your on. I just know what you said. And I'm glad you see nothing new. I try to remain consistent. Making this country better for my children. That's all. The ones winning and losing are probably not even born yet.


Defensive? Another typical liberal response. No, I dind't appreciate you labeling me something I am not. So because I called you out about it, you want to say I'm defensive. Tells me all I need to know.

I clearly explained what side I was on in a former post, in this thread. So either you're not paying attention or like listening to yourself ramble aloud with your extra long post without actually reading the others. So if you "don't know what side of anything I am on" and the next sentence you "just know what I said", how is that not contradictory?

By being persistent you're self admitting that you're closed minded, which was obvious before. But I'm sure you'll claim an open minded mentality while all the while staying persistent.... as long as the other people you're "discussing" things with, agree with you.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 6:50 pm 
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Cathal wrote:
Coots, getting defensive over nothing? Those are the people you don't want to get into a discussion with. Then again, it's usually best to not even get involved in these type of "debates" on the internet since it always ends up going nowhere.


Again with the word "defensive". He labeled me something that I'm not and I called him out about it and you start saying I'm defensive. No, I'm standing my ground. I have had plenty of discussions with several members on here for a lot of years. Ask Rich, he knows. After all we've been through, we still find each other chatting and discussing things. He's an open minded individual, so am I.

Then again, I question myself responding to a person who says it's not a good idea to get into a "debate" on the internet, all the while... getting into one.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:01 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Cathal wrote:
Coots, getting defensive over nothing? Those are the people you don't want to get into a discussion with. Then again, it's usually best to not even get involved in these type of "debates" on the internet since it always ends up going nowhere.


Is there a debate on the Internet that ends up going anywhere?

It seems you have unrealistic expectations for your Internet debates. You're setting yourself up for perpetual disappointment.



THIS.

I have my beliefs, you have yours. At the root of it we are all just Dolphins fans that I know if we were sitting at a game would high five every time Suh makes a sack.

I usually like these debates because I can gain insight to another side of the argument maybe I didn't see. One thing I'll never do is make a statement I cant explain or back. Sorry if you disagree.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:07 pm 
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Coots wrote:
Cathal wrote:
Coots, getting defensive over nothing? Those are the people you don't want to get into a discussion with. Then again, it's usually best to not even get involved in these type of "debates" on the internet since it always ends up going nowhere.


Again with the word "defensive". He labeled me something that I'm not and I called him out about it and you start saying I'm defensive. No, I'm standing my ground. I have had plenty of discussions with several members on here for a lot of years. Ask Rich, he knows. After all we've been through, we still find each other chatting and discussing things. He's an open minded individual, so am I.

Then again, I question myself responding to a person who says it's not a good idea to get into a "debate" on the internet, all the while... getting into one.




Dude. maybe I'm missing something. This is your Exact quote:

" Jammer just keeps on winning. I'm enjoying this."

What exactly did I mis represent and what did you call me out on? If anything that comment seemed like a stick poke and I just responded to it. I started off almost 3 responses to "lets agree to disagree". Lets. :yay:


Last edited by MiamiMenace on Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:09 pm 
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1984phins wrote:
In terms of demographics, the GOP problem is the only demographic they win is whites. They lose African Americans, Latinos, Asians, and Others.

And the white vote's share of the electorate shrinks ever so slightly each election. Remember, the GOP has only won 1 popular vote in the last 6 elections.



I agree. they need to change or continue to be not valid in the race for the presidency.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:20 pm 
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1984phins wrote:
MiamiMenace wrote:
Did you see who the latest supreme court appointments voted?


You mean how? Mixed Results for me. Didn't like the voting rights ruling, but enjoyed the Obamacare and Gay Marriage one.

MiamiMenace wrote:
Obama care is in full swing.


Good. Unless you want to replace it with single payer or public option, then I am all for getting rid of it.

MiamiMenace wrote:
Obama will veto the Iran deal and good luck on getting a majority vote to overturn it.


Yes, he will veto the opposition to the deal. Good.

MiamiMenace wrote:
glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president.


That works for me.



Sorry, just felt like being the smug liberal here. Carry on.


I'll be glad to discuss the specifics of each issue in another thread. I was just pointing out the GOP is in anything but good standing at this point unlike mentioned above. . They are losing ground in very important issues because they refuse to change to get more support from voters. This is All great news from your perspective I am sure. But if you don't agree with those issues. One giant step in that direction would be to place Pro life on the back burner. Try to get all of the women's votes. Try to empower them. Otherwise stand for it on the front burner, have Hillary win and then still get nothing done on every issue INCLUDING pro life issues. Change is good. And the GOP needs to change. I'm pulling for them because the same old same old is not going to bode well. Hillary will appoint further Supreme court Justices that will never take pro life anything or serious and will probably increase the current Planned parenthood standards.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:22 pm 
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1984phins wrote:
In terms of demographics, the GOP problem is the only demographic they win is whites. They lose African Americans, Latinos, Asians, and Others.


So why were there lower turnouts across the board to vote Democrat in 2010, 2012 and 2014?


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:34 pm 
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And if we're playing identity politics then it should be noted that the Democrat contenders consist of 3 white guys (when Biden officially runs) and a white lady. The GOP top contenders consist of a white lady, an African American guy, 2 Hispanic guys and 3 white guys.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:40 pm 
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jammer wrote:
1984phins wrote:
In terms of demographics, the GOP problem is the only demographic they win is whites. They lose African Americans, Latinos, Asians, and Others.


So why were there lower turnouts across the board to vote Democrat in 2010, 2012 and 2014?



Are you referring to the midterm elections of 2010 and 2014? If so, midterm elections have some stereotypes going for them. A) Voter turnout is lower and sometimes that helps the GOP. B) Voters often vote for divided government and the party in the White House usually loses control of Congress if they currently have it. Think back to 94 GOP takeover of the house under Clinton, Pelosi becoming speaker during Bush 43, and now GOP taking the Congress under Obama.

For example with part A:

65 years and older is a demographic that is solid GOP. In 2012, a presidential year, they made up 16% of the electorate. in 2014, a midterm year, they made up 22% of the electorate.

Total turnout: 2012 58%, 2014 41%

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Last edited by 1984phins on Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:41 pm 
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Change is good is too non specific imo. Change is not always good. Many times it can be. I doubt if many people on here would be glad to change to sharia law.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:42 pm 
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MiamiMenace wrote:
Coots wrote:
Cathal wrote:
Coots, getting defensive over nothing? Those are the people you don't want to get into a discussion with. Then again, it's usually best to not even get involved in these type of "debates" on the internet since it always ends up going nowhere.


Again with the word "defensive". He labeled me something that I'm not and I called him out about it and you start saying I'm defensive. No, I'm standing my ground. I have had plenty of discussions with several members on here for a lot of years. Ask Rich, he knows. After all we've been through, we still find each other chatting and discussing things. He's an open minded individual, so am I.

Then again, I question myself responding to a person who says it's not a good idea to get into a "debate" on the internet, all the while... getting into one.




Dude. maybe I'm missing something. This is your Exact quote:

" Jammer just keeps on winning. I'm enjoying this."

What exactly did I represent and what did you call me out on? If anything that comment seemed like a stick poke and I just responded to it. I started off almost 3 responses to "lets agree to disagree". Lets. :yay:


"Dude", are you that socially neglected that you don't remember the Charlie Sheen "winning" tirrades? I never said YOU represented anything, I said you labeled me something I'm not. And at the time, I was actually enjoying the exchange that was taking place. You're the one who apparently got offended and started labeling me something even though I didn't even address you specifcally in my "winning" post. For some reason, you took offense to it. Maybe should should reread and check the timeline of the comments on this post.

MiamiMenace wrote:
You think the GOP is doing well?

..glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president


You keep putting words in my mouth, labeling me something I'm not.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:53 pm 
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Again with the word "defensive". He labeled me something that I'm not and I called him out about it and you start saying I'm defensive. No, I'm standing my ground. I have had plenty of discussions with several members on here for a lot of years. Ask Rich, he knows. After all we've been through, we still find each other chatting and discussing things. He's an open minded individual, so am I.

Then again, I question myself responding to a person who says it's not a good idea to get into a "debate" on the internet, all the while... getting into one.[/quote]



Dude. maybe I'm missing something. This is your Exact quote:

" Jammer just keeps on winning. I'm enjoying this."

What exactly did I represent and what did you call me out on? If anything that comment seemed like a stick poke and I just responded to it. I started off almost 3 responses to "lets agree to disagree". Lets. :yay:[/quote]

"Dude", are you that socially neglected that you don't remember the Charlie Sheen "winning" tirrades? I never said YOU represented anything, I said you labeled me something I'm not. And at the time, I was actually enjoying the exchange that was taking place. You're the one who apparently got offended and started labeling me something even though I didn't even address you specifcally in my "winning" post. For some reason, you took offense to it. Maybe should should reread and check the timeline of the comments on this post.

MiamiMenace wrote:
You think the GOP is doing well?

..glad your enjoying yourself if Hillary Clinton is what you want for president


You keep putting words in my mouth, labeling me something I'm not.[/quote]


How's that? My comment never labeled anyone. I answered your stick poke with another one. If you can't take it , I guess you shouldn't dish it out. Sorry, I'm still relatively new here. I learned alot today . It's going to be a long political year here. I hope you lighten up.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:29 am 
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1984phins wrote:
Rich wrote:
AQNOR wrote:
I think it is a complete myth that the religious right is the reason the GOP lost the last two elections.


Studies done on the demographics of the voting public show that white Evangelicals did not have the same turnout for McCain and Romney as they did with Bush and the margins could have covered what McCain or Romney needed to win some purple states like Ohio.


Turnout for Romney: 26%
Turnout for McCain: 26%
Turnout for Bush 04: 23%


Are you referring to a state by state basis? These are the nat'l polls




http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sp ... table.html
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/result ... al=USP00p2
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/ ... lls.0.html


First of all, those are exit polls, which are wildly unreliable. Remember the exit polling showed Kerry beating Bush handily.

It is also well documented that white Evangelicals loved Bush and he specifically targetted that group with his compassionate conservatism approach. There was no love lost between white Evangelicals and McCain and in fact some white Evangelicals went to Obama because Obama positioned himself as an Evangelical and the "climate change" message resonates with some Evangelicals who believe in end times prophecies.

Lastly, a portion of white Evangelicals are not OK with Mormonism and Romney is a Mormon.

That being said, your percentages are misleading because they don't take into account actual count. As an example, there are 4 million "missing" white Evangelical votes from 2014. This means, people that were expected to vote but didn't.

Romney lost by less than 5 million votes. This is attributed in part because his campaign had developed a voter turnout system (I believe it was called ORCA) that crashed on the day of the election. It turns out they never did a live test with the system. That is strange coming from the guy who used to run Bain Capital.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:30 am 
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1984phins wrote:
Do you think the general public agrees with conservatives on social issues?


It is a mixed bag. I think more people are becoming more "pro life" as an example.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:32 am 
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AQNOR wrote:
I doubt if many people on here would be glad to change to sharia law.


Only if it applies to liberals.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:58 am 
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1984phins wrote:
Are you referring to the midterm elections of 2010 and 2014?


I specifically said 2010, 2012 and 2014. It sounded like you were suggesting the Democrats will continue to have an advantage because they win with identity politics. Their voter turnouts were down each year and are not trending in the right direction. *Note - yes, I realize more turned out in the 2012 presidential election but that was less than 2008, and, they lost seats in the House and Senate. I think that number will decrease again in 2016.

I hate to say it but Donald Trump might be the only figure who will drive up voter turn out (both for and against him). Its why I said a few posts back that he has tapped into the celebrity aspect that Americans love.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 10:39 am 
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Rich wrote:
1984phins wrote:
Do you think the general public agrees with conservatives on social issues?


It is a mixed bag. I think more people are becoming more "pro life" as an example.


I certainly do not have any data to back this up, but I'd say with how social issues are swinging more towards the liberal aspect, I'd say more people are pro choice. I do not believe the majority of people support the conservative platform on social issues.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:35 am 
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Cathal wrote:
Rich wrote:
1984phins wrote:
Do you think the general public agrees with conservatives on social issues?


It is a mixed bag. I think more people are becoming more "pro life" as an example.


I certainly do not have any data to back this up, but I'd say with how social issues are swinging more towards the liberal aspect, I'd say more people are pro choice. I do not believe the majority of people support the conservative platform on social issues.


Yes, most social issues are swinging liberal, but none of these other social issues involve ending a life.

For the last decade, Americans are becoming more and more supportive of restrictions on abortion. Whether it is banning abortions after the 1st trimester or completely banning late term abortions. Polls are swinging more and more toward the restriction side. Just check out Pew Research as an example.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 12:47 pm 
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Cathal wrote:
I certainly do not have any data to back this up, but I'd say with how social issues are swinging more towards the liberal aspect, I'd say more people are pro choice. I do not believe the majority of people support the conservative platform on social issues.


I said it before and will say it again, if the social issues are swinging left then why aren't things like gay marriage and abortion being settled via legislation or ballot questions? Why are the courts having to settle it? If I'm not mistaken, gay marriage has been overruled via ballot question far more than it has been accepted.

When media and celebrities are out promoting certain opinions we tend to think its a representation of the general public but its not always the case.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 2:05 pm 
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jammer wrote:
Cathal wrote:
I certainly do not have any data to back this up, but I'd say with how social issues are swinging more towards the liberal aspect, I'd say more people are pro choice. I do not believe the majority of people support the conservative platform on social issues.


I said it before and will say it again, if the social issues are swinging left then why aren't things like gay marriage and abortion being settled via legislation or ballot questions? Why are the courts having to settle it? If I'm not mistaken, gay marriage has been overruled via ballot question far more than it has been accepted.

When media and celebrities are out promoting certain opinions we tend to think its a representation of the general public but its not always the case.



Agendas. And this admin has lined up the Supreme court to rule exactly as planned. And it will continue and get worse if the GOP doesn't wake the F up. You think Obama ran these plans during his elections? Of course not. He STFU , towed the line , won , and is now having a field day.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:48 pm 
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MiamiMenace, Obama's two SCOTUS replaced two judges that were considered as usually voting on the liberal side. So he didn't really "pack" the courts.

And what plans did he secretly have???

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:57 pm 
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jammer wrote:
Cathal wrote:
I certainly do not have any data to back this up, but I'd say with how social issues are swinging more towards the liberal aspect, I'd say more people are pro choice. I do not believe the majority of people support the conservative platform on social issues.


I said it before and will say it again, if the social issues are swinging left then why aren't things like gay marriage and abortion being settled via legislation or ballot questions? Why are the courts having to settle it? If I'm not mistaken, gay marriage has been overruled via ballot question far more than it has been accepted.

When media and celebrities are out promoting certain opinions we tend to think its a representation of the general public but its not always the case.


Here is the Gallup trend : as of May, 60% supported marriage equality.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/117328/marriage.aspx

Abortion trend is volatile. Currently at 50% pro choice, 44% pro life.

Also, if you dissect it a bit, 81% are in favor of abortions in all (29%) or some (51%) circumstances. Only 19% are in favor of illegal in ALL circumstances. That is the current Walker position, apparently. So the GOP should be careful here.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:16 pm 
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1984phins wrote:
Here is the Gallup trend : as of May, 60% supported marriage equality.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/117328/marriage.aspx

Abortion trend is volatile. Currently at 50% pro choice, 44% pro life.

Also, if you dissect it a bit, 81% are in favor of abortions in all (29%) or some (51%) circumstances. Only 19% are in favor of illegal in ALL circumstances. That is the current Walker position, apparently. So the GOP should be careful here.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx


I could be wrong but I also think Rubio is of the position that all abortions should be illegal.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:24 pm 
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1984phins wrote:
MiamiMenace, Obama's two SCOTUS replaced two judges that were considered as usually voting on the liberal side. So he didn't really "pack" the courts.

And what plans did he secretly have???


I saw a bumper sticker the other day that summed it up perfectly. Obama put us in the toilet , elect Hillary and you are pulling the plunger.........

What plans? Look around you. Its all coming to fruition. Al Sharpton has had 81 dinners at the white house. We are having perfectly times race riots and clashes with the police. He sends aids to the funeral's of Felons, offers nothing to the men and women that keep this country safe. Its a disgrace. The one message from the other night I did really like that all the candidates stated was its time to stop dividing this country. Another 4 yrs with Hillary will seriously jeopardize Americas standing in the world. I believe it to my core. I really hope the GOP can pull it together.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:27 pm 
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Cathal wrote:
1984phins wrote:
Here is the Gallup trend : as of May, 60% supported marriage equality.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/117328/marriage.aspx

Abortion trend is volatile. Currently at 50% pro choice, 44% pro life.

Also, if you dissect it a bit, 81% are in favor of abortions in all (29%) or some (51%) circumstances. Only 19% are in favor of illegal in ALL circumstances. That is the current Walker position, apparently. So the GOP should be careful here.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx


I could be wrong but I also think Rubio is of the position that all abortions should be illegal.


He is Pro life yes. If he could get a little more less Religious right and concentrate more on Jobs, immigration and foreign policy , he would be a force to be reckoned with. Hispanic vote/ women/young people./white ..........they guy would KILL.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:55 pm 
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MiamiMenace wrote:
1984phins wrote:
MiamiMenace, Obama's two SCOTUS replaced two judges that were considered as usually voting on the liberal side. So he didn't really "pack" the courts.

And what plans did he secretly have???


What plans? Look around you. Its all coming to fruition. Al Sharpton has had 81 dinners at the white house. We are having perfectly times race riots and clashes with the police. He sends aids to the funeral's of Felons, offers nothing to the men and women that keep this country safe. Its a disgrace.


Oh, please.

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