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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:28 pm 
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Unless I'm missing somebody, in the last 10 drafts...out of ALL the QB's taken after round 1, (including Romo and the UDFA's), not a single one has won more than 1 Playoff game in their career.

And by my count, only Garrard and Romo have won 1 Playoff game.

Just sayin'....


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:37 pm 
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How about this:

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According to stats compiled by NFL Network's Mike Mayock, only seven of the last 82 quarterbacks drafted in rounds two through seven have gone on to become NFL starters.

Of the last 23 quarterbacks drafted in the first round, on the other hand, 15 have gone to become starters. Mayock views Michigan State's Kirk Cousins and Arizona State's Brock Osweiler as third-round quarterbacks. Bucs GM Mark Dominik tells the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel there's a chance Cousins could become "the Andy Dalton of this year's draft class."

http://rotoworld.com/player/nfl/7486/kirk-cousins


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:11 pm 
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I agree. This is interesting. You forgot TJ Yates, who if not for him, it'd have been Matt Schaub (both non-first rounders). And not that you were implying it, but it doesn't necessarily say that you have to be a 1st round quarterback to be successful.
Namely, because the playoff teams that win have consistently been the same quarterbacks...only a handful of which have been drafted in the last 10 years. Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Donavon McNabb have won a ton of playoff games but taken out of the equation due to being drafted prior to 2002.

The only quarterbacks to win playoff games since being drafted the last 10 years are:
Roethlisberger, Sanchez, Flacco, Rodgers, Manning, Rivers and Grossman

Roethlisberger, Sanches, Flacco, Rodgers, Grossman and Rivers were all brought into a very nice situation. Only Manning had to take the bull by the horns and really steer the franchise. So it's less that a team needs a 1st round quarterback, and more a 1st round quarterback needs a team.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:15 pm 
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In conclusion, I'd agree that taking a 1st round QB is the way to go....but as evident by the huge number of other 1st round quarterbacks that fell on their face, you need to a get a team first...then a quarterback.

I think we're right there. We've got a pretty good core...now add a quarterback. Among other pieces.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:33 pm 
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Iowafin wrote:
In conclusion, I'd agree that taking a 1st round QB is the way to go....but as evident by the huge number of other 1st round quarterbacks that fell on their face, you need to a get a team first...then a quarterback.

I think we're right there. We've got a pretty good core...now add a quarterback. Among other pieces.


I agree. I just fear for any QB who suits up for us next year. Weak WR corps, an O-line that readily gives up sacks...all we have is a decent run game.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:08 pm 
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Iowafin wrote:
but as evident by the huge number of other 1st round quarterbacks that fell on their face, you need to a get a team first...then a quarterback.


That may be so, it is the cart or the horse argument. Maybe those QBs failed from not having a team around them.

But maybe those QBs that succeeded made the team around them better.

One thing is for certain, a lot more QBs not taken in round 1 flop than QBs taken in round 1. The success ratio is much higher when you take a QB in round 1, as low as that ratio may be.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:15 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
but as evident by the huge number of other 1st round quarterbacks that fell on their face, you need to a get a team first...then a quarterback.


That may be so, it is the cart or the horse argument. Maybe those QBs failed from not having a team around them.

But maybe those QBs that succeeded made the team around them better.

One thing is for certain, a lot more QBs not taken in round 1 flop than QBs taken in round 1. The success ratio is much higher when you take a QB in round 1, as low as that ratio may be.


The chances of a QB succeeding from outside the first round are almost zero. In recent years, most 1st round QB's have panned out.

And iowa, I can't agree with that statement at all...You take a QB and build around him. You don't pass up QB's because your roster isn't ready yet. Whether he starts Day 1 or not is dependent on the team around him, but you don't pass them up because you aren't ready to compete.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:22 pm 
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This is the one time that Ireland needs to throw a little of that caution to the wind and do what it takes to get Tannehill. I can live with trying and failing over not trying and still failing.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:33 pm 
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The Texans took David Carr 1st back when they came in the league and tried to build around him and he darn near got killed.

For what it worth, Omar Kelly is now backing off Tannehill and now is back on Quinton Coples after the comments made by Jeff Ireland.

I think he might be reading to much into it, but we will see. I think Jeff is basically saying he will not be trading UP to get Tannehill. If he falls to Miami, fine, we may take him.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:49 pm 
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phinsfansc wrote:
For what it worth, Omar Kelly is now backing off Tannehill and now is back on Quinton Coples after the comments made by Jeff Ireland.


Hey, I've been in the Coples boat for the past couple of weeks myself. Still, Omar shouldn't change his opinion based off of comments made today by Ireland. I wouldn't believe anything said by Ireland as he will downplay players he is interested in, etc.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 5:14 pm 
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Phin wrote:
This is the one time that Ireland needs to throw a little of that caution to the wind and do what it takes to get Tannehill. I can live with trying and failing over not trying and still failing.


I like this. Can't blame a guy for trying, you can blame him for avoiding a 1st round QB like the plague.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:34 pm 
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phinsfansc wrote:
The Texans took David Carr 1st back when they came in the league and tried to build around him and he darn near got killed.


And the Colts took Peyton Manning and he lifted the franchise.

Works both ways.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:40 pm 
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Rich wrote:
phinsfansc wrote:
The Texans took David Carr 1st back when they came in the league and tried to build around him and he darn near got killed.


And the Colts took Peyton Manning and he lifted the franchise.

Works both ways.


It took time Rich, and Peyton took a beating himself for a while. But yes, they did go from 3-13 to 13-3, so it is possible.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:42 pm 
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Rich wrote:
phinsfansc wrote:
The Texans took David Carr 1st back when they came in the league and tried to build around him and he darn near got killed.


And the Colts took Peyton Manning and he lifted the franchise.

Works both ways.


It works both ways if you're a Manning.

Roethlisberger, Flacco, Rivers, Sanchez, Rodgers and Grossman were all handed pretty cushy jobs. Were some of them able to elevate their teams? Yes, but only were the Mannings able to make a losing team a Super Bowl team.

Without those other guys, those teams are average or possibly even winning teams if given average or slightly below average quarterbacks.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:23 pm 
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Iowafin wrote:
It works both ways if you're a Manning.

Roethlisberger, Flacco, Rivers, Sanchez, Rodgers and Grossman were all handed pretty cushy jobs. Were some of them able to elevate their teams? Yes, but only were the Mannings able to make a losing team a Super Bowl team.

Without those other guys, those teams are average or possibly even winning teams if given average or slightly below average quarterbacks.


By my count, at least 2 of those you listed are average or below average (Sanchez and Grossman, with Flacco still up for debate.) Big Ben, Rivers and Rodgers are the only legit difference makers in the mix, and Rodgers took a couple of years to incubate before he was ready.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:01 am 
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Rich wrote:
phinsfansc wrote:
The Texans took David Carr 1st back when they came in the league and tried to build around him and he darn near got killed.


And the Colts took Peyton Manning and he lifted the franchise.

Works both ways.


Miami's OL actually isn't bad and they do have a solid left to center side of their OL ... which protects the quarterback's blind side. I really don't see our OL being a problem in a quarterback's development as David Carr did and several of our young QBs did. The right side will definitely need to be addressed as they came close to breaking a team record for sacks allowed in a season.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:58 am 
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k-dash wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
It works both ways if you're a Manning.

Roethlisberger, Flacco, Rivers, Sanchez, Rodgers and Grossman were all handed pretty cushy jobs. Were some of them able to elevate their teams? Yes, but only were the Mannings able to make a losing team a Super Bowl team.

Without those other guys, those teams are average or possibly even winning teams if given average or slightly below average quarterbacks.


By my count, at least 2 of those you listed are average or below average (Sanchez and Grossman, with Flacco still up for debate.) Big Ben, Rivers and Rodgers are the only legit difference makers in the mix, and Rodgers took a couple of years to incubate before he was ready.


My point exactly.

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