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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:33 pm 
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I'd rather have Orton. He's younger and in his prime.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:51 pm 
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Go get this guy! Best option out there in terms of available by trade. I would like to see what Henne has with a different OC, but if Carson comes cheap, I'd forget about Henne in a second.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:53 pm 
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I bet that Pete Carroll will go after him.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:58 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Palmer is BY FAR the best option out there.

Yeah, because the other options suck. Palmer is no better than Henne.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:45 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
Palmer is BY FAR the best option out there.

Yeah, because the other options suck. Palmer is no better than Henne.


Was that sarcastic or serious?

If serious, Palmer has been dealing with crap on and off the field around him for years and has produced TONS more than Henne has the last 2 seasons. I think it's a MAJOR upgrade.


In your opinion.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:01 pm 
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Phins Rock, it is still an opinion.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:04 pm 
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My opinion is that Palmer is not an upgrade. I would not trade anything for him. If he gets released then fine bring him in.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:06 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Opinions?

Henne has had a better run game each year, I would argue a better WR core and certainly a better locker room environment to work with than Palmer has by a pretty significant margin.


Yes.
Opinions.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:18 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
Opinions?

Henne has had a better run game each year, I would argue a better WR core and certainly a better locker room environment to work with than Palmer has by a pretty significant margin.


Yes.
Opinions.


That part, as I insinuated, are opinions. But the numbers are fact. And the numbers indicate that Palmer is significantly better than Henne. Despite, in my opinion, playing with a lot less.


He has 20 more TD's...
Other than that, the numbers are pretty similar.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:27 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
He has 20 more TD's...
Other than that, the numbers are pretty similar.


Yeah, only 10 TD's more per season......That's nothing.
:)


How many TD's more per team?

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:28 pm 
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Carson Palmer, pre knee injury against Pittsburgh in the playoffs a few years ago was close to an elite QB.

After that injury, for what ever reason, he has not been the same. Then he had the injury to his elbow, which was a problem for a period of time.

I saw Carson play a few times, and while he played better those last 3 games without Chad Johnson and Terrell Owens, there were games were he looked worse than Chad Henne in regards to some of the interceptions he threw.

With no CBA in place, draft picks could be really precious. I certainly am not in favor of trading for Carson Palmer at this point in his career.

If Cincy releases him, that's a different story.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:32 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Henne has had a better run game each year, I would argue a better WR core and certainly a better locker room environment to work with than Palmer has by a pretty significant margin.

Like I said Palmer has had to deal with tons of crap over the years, especially this past season. Once TO and Ocho Cinco were out of the line-up, Palmer played much better. He's not 2005 Palmer, but even if he's 2009 Palmer it's still a major upgrade and I'd bet that with a couple of pieces to the O-line to protect him, we'd be a playoff team.


Better ground game? Not by much at all. Better receiving core? Ochocinco, TO, Gresham, Shipley? Serious?

Palmer is a better pedigree, but in terms of surrounding offensive cast his has been better.

I wouldn't be upset if Miami traded for him but to say he is some huge upgrade seems to be a bit of a stretch.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:41 pm 
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To say that Henne has had a better surrounding cast is laughable.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:03 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Rich wrote:
To say that Henne has had a better surrounding cast is laughable.


Thank you for explaining why.

To me, the WR core, RB, O-line, Defense and attitude of locker room have all been in Henne's favor. Only thing I'll give Palmer is TE.

There is no need to explain why.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:07 pm 
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Nobody out there right now is much of an upgrade over Henne & that is just pretty sad & pretty much the Dolphins luck as they are in such a need for a quality QB.
We should be wary of QB's who's play has not been the same after a knee injury , a lesson we should have learned when we signed the great C-Pepp.
Out of all the has beens & never was' that are or might be available Orton still might be the best option. If its at the right price sure take a look at Palmer but its a sad state we are in when we get so excited that a guy like Palmer has requested to be traded. Trade him here he might wish he were back in Cincy but honestly these are just lateral choices we have , nothing that says we are moving forward from the previous 2 seasons.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:11 pm 
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Palmer would be an upgrade over Henne, but his age and injury history doesn't make it a good move to me.....unless he comes to Miami VERY cheap. I prefer Orton. He could give us decent QB play while the team looks for and then grooms a new rookie.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:30 pm 
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The title of this thread is misleading. Should read "Speculation is Palmer Will Demand Trade"


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:11 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
jammer wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
Henne has had a better run game each year, I would argue a better WR core and certainly a better locker room environment to work with than Palmer has by a pretty significant margin.

Like I said Palmer has had to deal with tons of crap over the years, especially this past season. Once TO and Ocho Cinco were out of the line-up, Palmer played much better. He's not 2005 Palmer, but even if he's 2009 Palmer it's still a major upgrade and I'd bet that with a couple of pieces to the O-line to protect him, we'd be a playoff team.


Better ground game? Not by much at all. Better receiving core? Ochocinco, TO, Gresham, Shipley? Serious?

Palmer is a better pedigree, but in terms of surrounding offensive cast his has been better.

I wouldn't be upset if Miami traded for him but to say he is some huge upgrade seems to be a bit of a stretch.


Give me Marshall, Bess, Hartline, Fasano over the 4 you mentioned any day of the week.

Marshal> TO (by a huge margin...both on and off the field)
Bess>Ocho (at this point in Chad's career, he's really nothing more than a 3 or 4).
Hartline>Shipley (I like Shipley's potential as a slot guy, but right now Hartline's the more productive and versatile WR).
Gresham>Fasano (although Gresham dropped several key 3rd down passes throughout the season).

Henne also has a much better OT combo to protect him.


I'll give it you and expect better results with Palmer's supporting cast. Your assumption isn't fact, its just a guess...just like mine.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:28 pm 
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a lot of those yards and TD's this season came when they were down by 3 TD's in the 4th quarter with 3 minutes left, and defenses would play prevent.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:04 pm 
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oldgreg07 wrote:
I'd rather have Orton. He's younger and in his prime.


I agree with this. Palmer would be a waste of money.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:14 pm 
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Caleb Hanie had a good game today, lets get him from the Bears. Clearly better then Henne.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:15 pm 
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No to injury prone 31 year old soon to be washed up QBs please

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 1:36 am 
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dolphinjim wrote:
No to injury prone 31 year old soon to be washed up QBs please


31 years old really isn't that old for a quarterback. Quarterbacks can remain in their prime well into their mid to late 30s. Palmer is two years younger than Brady and three years younger than Manning.

I, for one, am with PR and think he would be a fantastic addition.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 2:38 am 
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is this really news? Never saw it reported.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 2:43 am 
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Quote:
He has 20 more TD's...
Other than that, the numbers are pretty similar.



:) thats just hilarious


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 2:46 am 
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FrustratedFinFan wrote:
Palmer would be an upgrade over Henne, but his age and injury history doesn't make it a good move to me.....unless he comes to Miami VERY cheap. I prefer Orton. He could give us decent QB play while the team looks for and then grooms a new rookie.



who isn't an upgrade over Henne at this point?


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 2:56 am 
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:19 am 
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We're trying to build a team with draft picks and younger veteran free agents, I'm not too sure an older veteran like Palmer is what we want. Besides, stop gaps like Palmer haven't worked out very well for us in the past. I'd be much happier if we either drafted a kid early on or gave Henne another shot if we can't find the right guy in the draft. Get some new runningbacks and build up the offensive line, that's the first thing we need to do.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 11:55 am 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Opinion? Numbers over last 2 seasons...

Palmer:
47 TDs
33 INTs
7064 yards
6.7 ypa
61.2 comp. %
QB rating: 83

Henne:
27 TDs
33 INTs
6179 yards
6.6 ypa
61.1 comp. %
QB rating: 75.3

Henne has had a better run game each year, I would argue a better WR core and certainly a better locker room environment to work with than Palmer has by a pretty significant margin.

Like I said Palmer has had to deal with tons of crap over the years, especially this past season. Once TO and Ocho Cinco were out of the line-up, Palmer played much better. He's not 2005 Palmer, but even if he's 2009 Palmer it's still a major upgrade and I'd bet that with a couple of pieces to the O-line to protect him, we'd be a playoff team.



Palmer also had a great wr CREW AND COULD NOT DO ANYTHING WITH THEM.. SORRY bUT i THINK THIS WOULD BE A HUGE MISTAKE..


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:57 pm 
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If this story is true and Palmer is using the retirement card to get what he wants then he obviously is looking to land on a team with some stability. After everything that just happened in Miami over the last month do you think he is chomping at the bit to come here? Play for a coaching staff that may not be in Miami next year? Get saddled with another diva receiver in Marshall?

I'd have to think Minnesota, Tennessee and San Francisco would be more attractive at this point. Maybe even Arizona.

Wonder what the cost would be as well? 2nd and 4th rounders? Not sure Miami has the ammo unless Cincy is willing to give him up for a bargain.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 1:34 pm 
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Take it for what it is worth a Blog on Carson Palmer::


Call Carson's bluff, Bengals. Let him quit

Carson Palmer was part of the problem, and now he wants out. Terrific. So in addition to his reconstructed knee, obvious arm issues and passive form of leadership, we can add quitter to his list of issues.

Contrary to what many think, Palmer was never an innocent victim of Bengal-dom. He was part of the problem, the one player with enough clout -- right position, right salary, right reputation -- to reign in the malcontents in his own huddle. Me-first receivers like T.J. Houshmandzadeh and Chad Johnson, and then Chad Ochocinco and Terrell Owens, ran roughshod in that locker room because, in part, Palmer let them.

Yes, sure, coach Marvin Lewis let them, too. Lewis is a weak, weak head coach. Maybe he would be a good coach, with the right chemistry, but with Mike Brown turning the Bengals into the Island of Misfit Toys, Lewis was the wrong coach. Cincinnati needed a bad cop. Instead it got that chuckling softy, Marvin Lewis.

But it also got Carson Palmer, exerting none of his influence, diminishing his own power to the point that he was the team's most expensive player, most important player, maybe even its most talented player -- but he was just another guy in that locker room. No more influential than anyone else.

Palmer was so mentally weak that, as his injuries mounted and his numbers started to decline, the Bengals brought in the most harmless backup quarterback in the history of the NFL -- the starter's little brother. With Jordan Palmer as the No. 2, there was never a question who would be No. 1. Carson never had to worry. Never had to compete.

His production kept sliding. His impact in the locker room kept receding. He never said a harsh word about the idiots around him, his silence setting free Ochocinco and Houshmandzadeh and Owens.

Now he wants out? Really? Palmer doesn't deserve a fresh start. He helped steer this team into the iceberg, so he can go down with the ship. Or he can do the most Carson Palmer-like maneuver imaginable and quit.


http://gregg-doyel.blogs.cbssports.com/ ... 6/27206938


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 2:16 pm 
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http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/B ... dlines2col


And The Staff does not plan to grant his wish... GOOD sorry but I'm tired of the DEMANDS!! you Get paid mega bucks to play football. if you can't do the time don't sign the contract... happy retirement!


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 2:28 pm 
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FIns2Win wrote:
and passive form of leadership


That will work great in Miami.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:55 pm 
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Henne sucks...Palmer is an upgrade


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:59 pm 
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Rich wrote:
To say that Henne has had a better surrounding cast is laughable.



To say Cam Cameron should keep his job because he is a good coach(like you did) is laughable


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 11:06 am 
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I'm thinking "no". He's not the same quarterback and he is too expensive via a trade. I think the Bengals would love to trade him.

The Phinsider wrote:
Palmer hasn't exactly been the same since suffering an elbow injury that nearly forced him to undergo Tommy John surgery in 2008.

Since the injury, Palmer has noticeably lost velocity on his passes and has been inconsistent with his accuracy. Palmer also has never been the most mobile quarterback in the world - and has become even less mobile in the pocket as age has caught up to him.

With all that said, Palmer still could bring a lot to this Miami offense. His experience and leadership alone has to tempt this Dolphins front office. And regardless of his lost velocity, Palmer's ability to read defenses and anticipate throws would be a giant plus for an offense that was just plain bad in 2010.

There are two other factors to consider here, though. One, of course, is Palmer's cost. What will it take to get him from the Bengals? A first round pick? If so, is that worth it?

What about Carson's insane contract. Palmer is still owed $50 million over the next four years, including a salary of $11.5 million in 2011. That's a steep price to pay for an aging quarterback.

Perhaps even more importantly, the Dolphins might not even be able to trade for Palmer - or any other player, for that matter - for quite a while. No players can be traded until there is a new collective bargaining agreement reached. Can the Dolphins afford to wait as long as it may take to trade for Carson?

Palmer is an intriguing option. But even this former first overall pick wouldn't come without numerous question marks.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:56 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:
Give me Marshall, Bess, Hartline, Fasano over the 4 you mentioned any day of the week.

Marshal> TO (by a huge margin...both on and off the field)
Bess>Ocho (at this point in Chad's career, he's really nothing more than a 3 or 4).
Hartline>Shipley (I like Shipley's potential as a slot guy, but right now Hartline's the more productive and versatile WR).
Gresham>Fasano (although Gresham dropped several key 3rd down passes throughout the season).

Henne also has a much better OT combo to protect him.


Again, opinions. There is no arguing against Marshall being the best of the bunch, but TO and Ocho aren't exactly light years behind him and are better than any other receiver Miami has. Ocho's problems seem to be injury and attitude, not skill level. Long is better than any guy on Cincy, but was Cincy's overall line worse than Miami's? Henne was sacked more times in fewer games and both teams were in the 20s for rushing offense.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:59 pm 
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when i see this thread title all I keep seeing is this;

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TRADE ME RIGHT F***ING NOW!

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 2:09 pm 
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Phins Rock wrote:

Henne's line in the last 3 games of the year was horrendous. But I thought before Vernon went down that he was getting fine protection. But you know as well as I that sack number has as much to do with a QB as it does the O-line. Was Dan Marino's O-line in 1988(?) really THAT good that they only allowed 8(?) sacks all season?


That is a fair point and I thought about it when I posted. But its probably impossible to measure at this point how many of those sacks were on the line or the QB so I'm just going off of the numbers.

How about this, at this point I'm highly skeptical that either guy is behind center next year. Up until about a week ago I assumed Henne would be, at the very least because lack of alternatives. But with the recent comments of Daboll, Ross and Dee I'm thinking Miami is constructing a new plan that has a vet and rookie come in (ala Pennington/Henne 2008). Not saying I agree with it, but seems the winds might be blowing in that direction.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 2:51 pm 
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Carson won't be traded anyways... Ochocinco tried the same thing last year.


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