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 Time to go to Thigpen 
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
The wildcat was kind of a strange call....but it did yield one TD today. Could it possibly be a lack of faith in Henne???????????

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Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:08 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Makchell wrote:
When Miami takes the handcuffs off he drove Miami down for a TD. Then they get the ball back & he drives them to the 30, had a hot hand. It was 2nd & 10 & Henning calls the WC, which went no where & put Henne in a 3rd & 10. Then you get pissed because he cannot come in & bail them out??

I was so pissed at that decision. Henne was 11-12 before that and they pull him out for the freaking WC. Wow.


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Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:09 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
The wildcat was kind of a strange call....but it did yield one TD today. Could it possibly be a lack of faith in Henne???????????

Well, you never see "stud" QBs pulled out of the game in the redzone for a gimmick, that's for sure. I think it's a lack of faith, but the coaches aren't helping either.


Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:21 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Bottom line is, we lost. And it is squarely on the hands of the offense. We couldn't even get a FG closer than 48yards. Henne is a .500 QB. Always has been, and always will be. Take him out. Thigpen needs to play for a roster spot.

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
Yeah Jim, ignore that INT that set up a Bills TD again why don't ya'? It was more than a stat line.
Who said to ignore it? I simply ask was the ball not hit right before the throw? If the answer is "Yes" then what is your problem with the question?

FrustratedFinFan wrote:
The guy completed a slew of short passes, whooppeee-do. He is the leader of the offense and the offense stinks, week in and week out. He is not accurate. He holds the ball too long. He is a statue in the pocket and the Bills used the blitz today to illustrate that fact. He leaves big plays on the field. He can't run a two minute drill to save his life. His "inspired" teammates show you how they feel by walking back to the huddle.

Other than your hatered for Henne. What are you basing the "He can't run a two minute drill to save his life comment?" on? He drove Miami to the 30 & was in game tying FG range with a 1st & 10. Only because Carperter missed the FG is this Henne's comment made.

FrustratedFinFan wrote:
And...no, Henne didn't get hit....I think the ball might have been grazed on the INT, but it didn't matter....the defender was in the position to catch the ball and had solid coverage....not the receiver. Stupid throw. Henne never seems to stay alive in the pocket, does he?

So you know for a fact that had the ball not been hit, that the defender is still able to get in that position, because a wobbling ball travels just like a spiral ball?

Even so. He threw 45 passes today & you really have one pass to complain about. One!! Miami is asking Henne to throw 45 times. GMB. You people expect a player to be perfect with everything, the whole game, 16 games a year?

Only someone who has never played at any level would expect such perfection.


Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:45 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Guess we will all have to wait until next year and what this regime does utilizing Henne. It is just safe to say his starting job is on shaky ground, no matter how many arguments are made for or against him.

Whether Sparano stays or a new coach comes, one thing you can hedge bets on and that is Henne WILL have QB competition to earn the starting role.


Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:51 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Insults won't change my mind at all. I base my feelings about Henne on the body of his work and never claimed today was the sole reason to bench him...

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Last edited by FrustratedFinFan on Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:53 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Finhead wrote:
Guess we will all have to wait until next year and what this regime does utilizing Henne. It is just safe to say his starting job is on shaky ground, no matter how many arguments are made for or against him.

Whether Sparano stays or a new coach comes, one thing you can hedge bets on and that is Henne WILL have QB competition to earn the starting role.


Henne is no lock to stay if a new regime blows in. We see this time and time again, they bring in their own guys.

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
I agree Rock and if Sparano stays, Henne will have to completely earn that starting job as this time he will not go into next season with the assumption the keys will handed over to him. Either way, I see competition coming in and either Henne will respond and get better or off holding a clip board. The guy has had plenty of chances and I welcome that competition for sure.


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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
Yeah Jim, ignore that INT that set up a Bills TD again why don't ya'? It was more than a stat line.

The guy completed a slew of short passes, whooppeee-do. He is the leader of the offense and the offense stinks, week in and week out. He is not accurate. He holds the ball too long. He is a statue in the pocket and the Bills used the blitz today to illustrate that fact. He leaves big plays on the field. He can't run a two minute drill to save his life. His "inspired" teammates show you how they feel by walking back to the huddle.


And...no, Henne didn't get hit....I think the ball might have been grazed on the INT, but it didn't matter....the defender was in the position to catch the ball and had solid coverage....not the receiver. Stupid throw. Henne never seems to stay alive in the pocket, does he?



Henne has to be Jim's cousin


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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Henne has to be Jim's cousin


HAHA priceless :)


Sun Dec 19, 2010 9:40 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Henne has to be Jim's cousin

These are the type of posts that we are talking about. There is no need for this comment. It brings nothing to the conversation expect antagonize the poster. Please stay on topic.


Sun Dec 19, 2010 9:43 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Makchell wrote:
Henne has to be Jim's cousin

These are the type of posts that we are talking about. There is no need for this comment. It brings nothing to the conversation expect antagonize the poster. Please stay on topic.


Agreed. I would say the same thing about the "+12" and "+16" comments, and many of the other comments on this thread. These are totally unnecessary and a waste of everyone's time. It's the reason I don't come to this site much anymore. About every month or so I pop in, check out a few threads, get discouraged, and bail. I only make this post because the mod is making an effort, so I am applauding that effort and adding my $.02. People who are interested in a semi-intelligent discussion regarding their favorite team won't come to a site with these types of posts. It's like reading what's written on the walls of a stall in the rest room. It's disappointing, because there are several posters here who can get involved in discussions (even heated ones) and make valid points, whether you agree with that person or not (miss you T-Rock).

Now onto the football...

I think Henne locks onto his first read almost every passing down, inviting the defense to "see his cards" so to speak. I also think that he takes too long to make his decisions, whether it is to in fact throw it to his first read, throw it into the stands, or take a sack (the last one really isn't a decision; it's more like a result of not making a decision fast enough). I think Sparano made a good decision a few weeks ago when he benched Henne for Penny, but then made a poor decision by not sticking with his original decision. I would've liked to see what Thigpen would do against Oakland, and I would still like to see what he can do, and the quick hook he got after three practices with the first team and a home game against the solid Chicago defense is not an audition at all. We know nothing about Thigpen with our offense, and that's Sparano's fault. I liked him so much since he came here, but this team stopped improving last year. Then he chose to waffle and go back to Henne, and I lost most of my faith in Sparano. If he goes at the end of this season so be it (and this is getting easier to say every week even though I still like Sparano).

I also think that I would gladly take back Camarillo for Benny Sapp, who almost made me faint when he made that pick, but allowed me to recover quickly with that foolish decision to pitch it to Vontae. If brains were dynamite, those two dudes couldn't blow each other's noses. And I thought Sean Smith was the best CB we drafted two years ago, but I was totally wrong, and that dude needs to practice with the receivers for a few weeks or something, because his stone hands are beyond ridiculous. And I wish I knew what Dansby was looking at when Nelson caught that TD on him. So it isn't all Henne's fault, but...

I think Henne inspires no confidence because he makes poor choices, and the offense knows it (and the defense figures it out by watching his eyes). And those of you who are watching the games without rose-colored glasses know it too. I know you want to support your team, but your QB is supposed to be your leader, and this guy ain't that. Henne doesn't have to be Peyton or Brady or Brees, but I would like him to be closer to Matt Ryan, and those two don't reside in the same neighborhood. I watched Ryan at Seattle today, and he was in command, changing plays at the line, making good decisions, looking off defenders, and being Atlanta's leader. Henne comes off the field looking like a whipped dog. Nobody is following a whipped dog into battle.

Let's see if Thigpen can do better. Just like with most elections, I'll go with the evil I don't know over the evil I know. Go Phins.

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
IamPZ wrote:
Ick McNabb and Palmer?? Sadly I think I'd rather have Orton out of the 3.


Could you possibly imagine saying that at the start of the 2010 season? Amazing how far those two fell in value this year.


Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:24 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
It's the reason I don't come to this site much anymore.

That should be motivation to join in more. We need more posters like you!


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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Makchell wrote:
It's the reason I don't come to this site much anymore.

That should be motivation to join in more. We need more posters like you!


Its not just the forums. Game chat seems to be a battlefield as well, although I can understand the emotion of the game driving some of that.


Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:52 pm
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Agreed. I would say the same thing about the "+12" and "+16" comments, and many of the other comments on this thread. These are totally unnecessary and a waste of everyone's time.[quote][/quote]

Thank you, I rarely involve myself in the discussions, even having been a member of this forum for a number of years, and enjoyed it's information, for that reason.

However.

My personal opinion is that Henne requires more time (another season), I understand those who disagree, but I am not of their opinion. He may go either way but I would not wish to make a final judgement just yet.

My belief is that in most sports consistancy is the key. In my experience the most sucessfull teams are the ones with the most settled squad/staff, regardless of which sport they are involved in. Henne may not be the answer but I believe that to make wholesale changes in both personel and coaching staff at this time is an error, because it mearly perpetuates the Dolphins perennial issue, (Since the Don), a lack of a settled philosophy. We currently have many good/great pieces in place (Wake, Misi, Dansby, Marshall, Hartline, Bess, Davis, Smith, Long, Incognito, Solai, Bell, Caroll, etc), give them a little morer time.

I also agree that Henning has outgrown his usefullness, his offence appears to be very outdated and predictable, however to call for the head of Sparano at this stage seems to me to be a little premature, little by little he and Ireland appear to be improving this team for the long term, solid, not spectacular. Have he and Ireland missed on a number of calls, Yes, have they hit big on a number of others, again, Yes, in my opinion.

To be an every year contender, first you have to be a contender, then you can afford to take BPA and trade every draft (see New England) and roll with the misses/Injuries when they happen.
I realise that I have never played the game (I'm English therefore played Rugby) but the basics of team sports, it seems to me, are not that different, in general.

Just my opinion :)

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Mon Dec 20, 2010 2:07 am
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Hang 10 wrote:

I think Henne inspires no confidence because he makes poor choices, and the offense knows it (and the defense figures it out by watching his eyes). And those of you who are watching the games without rose-colored glasses know it too. I know you want to support your team, but your QB is supposed to be your leader, and this guy ain't that.
Two different QBs played today for Miami. The one that played most of the game & the one that played the final two drives. I believe the true Henne is the one that played on the final two drives. The one that plays the rest of the time is trying not to make a mistake.

Hang 10 wrote:

Henne doesn't have to be Peyton or Brady or Brees, but I would like him to be closer to Matt Ryan, and those two don't reside in the same neighborhood.
Ryan was a top 3 picks & has started for 3 Yrs. Henne is working on 1 3/4 Yrs

Hang 10 wrote:

I watched Ryan at Seattle today, and he was in command, changing plays at the line, making good decisions, looking off defenders, and being Atlanta's leader. Henne comes off the field looking like a whipped dog. Nobody is following a whipped dog into battle.
FYI. Ryan is more experienced, has a running game & quality OC calling his plays.

Hang 10 wrote:

Let's see if Thigpen can do better. Just like with most elections, I'll go with the evil I don't know over the evil I know. Go Phins.
Its the evil I know over the evil I don't know.

We saw how Thigpen plays a few weeks ago. Miami never scored.


Mon Dec 20, 2010 2:17 am
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
MdDolfan wrote:
when is it ever going to fall on Henne for some of you guys?


Certainly not when he throws for nearly a 75% completion percentage and a shade under 300 yards.

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
jammer wrote:
Makchell wrote:
It's the reason I don't come to this site much anymore.

That should be motivation to join in more. We need more posters like you!


Its not just the forums. Game chat seems to be a battlefield as well, although I can understand the emotion of the game driving some of that.


I stopped going to the game chat when I realized that many people seem only to watch the game in order to criticize Henne. It seems that for some, that tis their sole motivation. They sit and wait and pounce upon the first mistake, and make ant hills in to mountains.

Last week people criticize his completion percentage; this week when Henne throws for nearly 75%, they complain that the completions weren't good enough.

For most he can't do anything right, and during the game chat it all becomes painfully obvious.

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Mon Dec 20, 2010 2:29 am
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Dphins4me wrote:
Ryan is more experienced, has a running game & quality OC calling his plays.


While of course you're right about Ryan having a superb running game, you need to remember that this genius OC you speak of is the same Mike Mularkey that many here would have chased out of town with pitchforks just a few years ago.

And we need to remember that last year when Ryan's running game wasn't dominant, his play declined in every single category. Every. Single. One. He had fewer TDs, more INTs, a lower completion percentage, the whole shebang. I'm not sure why so many want to completely disconnect Henne's performance and progression from our PUTRiD running game.

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
eleaf wrote:
I stopped going to the game chat when I realized that many people seem only to watch the game in order to criticize Henne. It seems that for some, that tis their sole motivation. They sit and wait and pounce upon the first mistake, and make ant hills in to mountains.

Last week people criticize his completion percentage; this week when Henne throws for nearly 75%, they complain that the completions weren't good enough.

For most he can't do anything right, and during the game chat it all becomes painfully obvious.


..... Or there are people who are tired of his inflated statistics chalk full of checkdowns. His poor pocket presence. His pathetic 4th quarter QB rating. His untimely interceptions. His forcing of passes. His inability to hit a deep ball. His absolute lack of "take charge" of this offense and routinely leaving plays on the field. Nobody is putting the entire blame on him, but we certainly feel as though he deserves a large share of it, after all he's the team's QB and the staggering regression we've seen in his play deserves criticism.

E-Leaf, it's clear you watch the game you want to watch. Throwing out the 75% stat is the kind of thing a person does who never watches the games and only reads the morning paper's box score. If we're not good enough for you to be in a chat room with, by all means man .... we'll be fine without you.

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Dphins4me wrote:

We saw how Thigpen plays a few weeks ago. Miami never scored.


So you are basing your opinion of Thigpen off of one game?


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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
AQNOR wrote:
Dphins4me wrote:

We saw how Thigpen plays a few weeks ago. Miami never scored.


So you are basing your opinion of Thigpen off of one game?


Quite apparently. 1 game on 3 days preparation/rest with mounting injuries that would make a M.A.S.H unit blush. Funny how "patience" goes right out the window in regards to giving Thigpen a legitimate chance to see what he could with the offense.

Oh and then there's the Chief's argument. His lone season, which he actually helped them put points on the board. Gailey had him playing much like he has Fitz now. They talk about Miami having no run game, well the Chiefs were dead last in that department that year and their defense was nothing to write home about.

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
AQNOR wrote:
Dphins4me wrote:

We saw how Thigpen plays a few weeks ago. Miami never scored.


So you are basing your opinion of Thigpen off of one game?


funny isn't it?


Mon Dec 20, 2010 2:54 am
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Quote:
Receiving Stats
Player No Yds Avg Long TD
Brandon Marshall 60 709 11.8 46 2
Davone Bess 62 673 10.9 29 3
Brian Hartline 43 615 14.3 54 1
Anthony Fasano 34 467 13.7 31 4
Ronnie Brown 23 166 7.2 24 0
Ricky Williams 12 86 7.2 28 1
Patrick Cobbs 7 78 11.1 29 2
Marlon Moore 3 77 25.7 57 1
Roberto Wallace 4 46 11.5 19 0
Lousaka Polite 8 41 5.1 14 0
Lex Hilliard 1 3 3.0 3 0
Dolphins 257 2961 11.5 57 14
Opponent 241 2807 11.6 86 15


so too rock and all you other people saying that Henne's stats are over rated because all he does is check down....U R DEAD WRONG!!!... Our 3 leading recievers going into today's game are our top 3 wideouts!!..sorry to bother u with the facts, but what we have is a short to intermediate passing game...lot of times with only 2 man routes cause our line play has been crap that we go to max protect...IF YOU KEEP 7 IN TO BLOCK AND HENNE GETS TIME, that does not mean the line is playing well !!! Pretty easy to cover a 2 man route and that leaves a back out of the back field as the only open guy.....
While I tend to think when pressured he doesn't do a good job of keeping the play alive, and he has left some plays out there that could be made, the more I see this offense, I feel Henne's play is more an extension of our OC and HC then anything else. He is not coached to win, but rather not to lose and our play calling is the same. This is the Pennington school of qb ing, but that was cause Pennington had no arm...Henne does....so we need to take the rains off and see what happens...when we get a running game and O line that is !!!


Mon Dec 20, 2010 3:10 am
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Phin wrote:
AQNOR wrote:

What less fundamental tools does he have then Henne that you can tell from limited outings? Are you basing it off of just that one game? If other games what exactly are you refering too?

Henne shows more poise in the pocket, has a better arm, is more patient, has better leadership skills, has ice water for blood, ect.. That is not a comprehensive list by any means, but the point Im making is that Henne has better building blocks than Thigpen. The one thing Thigpen has over Henne is his physical abilities. IMO



You can tell all of this from one game in this offense?


Mon Dec 20, 2010 3:13 am
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Rock Sexton wrote:

..... Or there are people who are tired of his inflated statistics chalk full of checkdowns.


This is EXACTLY my argument personified.

It doesn't matter what he does. Some will never be happy. When he does poorly, he takes flak (rightly). When he does well, it's "inflated statistics." The guy threw for almost 300 yards. What else do you want as far as yards are concerned? At what point will they not be "inflated"?

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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
and the 13 with the Chiefs !!!


Mon Dec 20, 2010 3:22 am
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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Thigpen cannot overcome this & may explain why he looked so pathetic against the Bears. Everyone needs to be sure to read the "BOLD" part at the end. It explains why Miami does not go down field often.

Quote:
"Why would anyone be surprised?" Buffalo cornerback Drayton Florence asked about the first play, the one where Wildcat formation was inserted on second-and-10 from the Bills' 31 with just over two minutes to play. "They were playing for a field goal. That's what they do."

It's all so Wannstedtian, this philosophy. Win with defense. Fear the quarterback. And, well, you can understand how it's come to that if you've watched Chad Henne play in 2010.

------------


"Thought that was a good play and that was it,'' Dolphins coach Tony Sparano said by way of explanation.

Let be fair. Ronnie Brown ran 6 yards for a touchdown earlier off the Wildcat. But this felt all different.

"We thought, 'playing for a field goal,' '' Bills safety George Wilson said. "And we stuffed them there."

-------



We watched the Jets game this week and saw Henne was getting hit a lot and didn't look comfortable in the pocket,'' Florence said. "We knew they'd had some [problems] on the line and that Tony Sparano was a line coach.

"So we knew two things. One, Henne wouldn't be holding the ball long on most plays. And, two, if they were going to throw medium or long, they'd have maximum protection and only send two guys out."


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Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
Rock Sexton wrote:
E-Leaf, it's clear you watch the game you want to watch. Throwing out the 75% stat is the kind of thing a person does who never watches the games and only reads the morning paper's box score. If we're not good enough for you to be in a chat room with, by all means man .... we'll be fine without you.


You pulled this stuff with me in the chat room. I asked for a run down of the game and didn't want it from a couple of the guys , whom I wont name, who would no matter what say Henne sucked. I actually would have welcomed your assessment but you instead chose to say I hear what I want to hear.

Using the stat line to say Henne wasn't awful is fine. Sounds to me like he was his pedestrian self and made some throws down the stretch. Nothing to be happy about, nothing to really bash. He isn't good enough to take over a game and I think everyone is in agreement with that. Its a problem that should be dealt with. But the lack of a run game and some questionable play calling are part of the equation.

Truth is if Carpenter hits two of those field goals and Miami wins then most probably say Henne played a mediocre game and didn't do anything special. But because they lost its all on Henne for some and he played a crap game. It just gets old, as I imagine the "nice pass Chad" comments do in the chat when he hits a 7 yard pass.


Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:15 am
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Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:59 am
Posts: 21598
Location: Miami, FL
Post Re: Time to go to Thigpen
FrustratedFinFan wrote:
Insults won't change my mind at all.


Nobody is insulting you, unless of course you consider being replied to with logical opinions an insult. In that case, you're being verbally murdered.

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Mon Dec 20, 2010 5:06 pm
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